Finding Clarity: Sleep Divorce, Invisibility Cloaks and Mental Health with counsellor, Alison Miller
Episode Details
Transcript
This conversation explores the intersection of mental health and aging, focusing on the experiences of women as they navigate hormonal changes, career transitions, and societal expectations. Andrea and Alison discuss the impact of perimenopause and menopause on emotional well-being, the empowerment that can come with aging, and the role of social media in shaping perceptions of self-worth.
Through personal anecdotes and professional insights, they highlight the importance of self-acceptance and the need to prioritize mental health during life's transitions. In this conversation, Alison and Andrea discuss the multifaceted challenges women face during menopause, including mental health issues, the impact of social media on self-perception, and the importance of self-care. They explore symptoms of mental health struggles during this phase, the significance of sleep, and the need for women to seek help when necessary. The discussion also touches on coping strategies, the importance of positive self-talk, and the societal perceptions surrounding menopause.
Links and Resources
Connect with The F*CK You 50s
Key Takeaways
- Mental health is crucial as we age.
- Hormonal changes significantly impact emotional well-being.
- Career transitions can lead to personal fulfillment.
- Aging can empower women to prioritize themselves.
- Social media often distorts reality and affects mental health.
- Comparison to others can diminish joy and self-worth.
- Accepting change is a vital part of personal growth.
- Navigating societal expectations can be challenging for women.
- Understanding hormonal shifts can help manage anxiety.
- Empowerment comes from embracing one's identity and experiences. Stop getting your information from social media.
- Confusion is a significant symptom during menopause.
- If you can't sleep, it affects your mental health.
- If you think you have a mental health problem, seek help.
- Choosing yourself is a powerful statement.
- Sleep is crucial for overall well-being.
- It's okay to prioritize self-care and kindness to oneself.
- Awareness of menopause is important, but oversaturation can be overwhelming.
- Women facing menopause often feel vulnerable and overlooked.
- Positive self-talk can help combat negative thoughts.
Andrea
Yeast infections. Okay. Now that the guys are no longer listening oh my god. Who actually remembers that ridiculous t TV commercial from the nineties? Oh my god. I remember it. And every time it came on, I was rolling my eyes and turning the channel. My grandparents lived in Chicago. And during one of my visits, watching TV with them, a Vagisil commercial came on. My poor grandmother was very upset, muttering how ridiculous it was, adding that we never see any commercials for jock itch. I would say that was probably the most vulgar thing I've ever heard come out of my grandmother's mouth. Of course, to most of us, this would not be remotely considered vulgar. I was so close to my grandma Jean. She passed when I was eighteen, and I was a mess. Honestly, I still think of her and breaking a tear sometimes. I loved her, but I digress. I think the first time that I ever had a yeast infection, I was fourteen. Eighties latchkey kids, we are tough. I would take myself to doctor's appointments. I always followed instructions for what adults would tell me what to do. I'll unpack that later, maybe on a future episode with a psychotherapist. Well, I ended up getting a pap smear. Imagine being a fourteen year old, a virgin, underage, no parent with you at the doctor's office, and you're told to remove your clothes and put your feet up in stirrups. Thank god it was a female doctor. Still emotionally scarred, though. Anyway, a couple days later, I get a phone call from the doctor's office saying that there was a prescription being sent to the pharmacy for me. I don't remember actually knowing why. I mean, let's be honest. That was a few years ago. So maybe they told me, but all I remember was calling my mother at work and asking her to pick up my prescription on her way home. Well, she gets home, and she hands me a prescription bag and ask if there's anything that I wanted to discuss with her. The bag was so fucking big. It was like it was shoes in there or something. Anyway, I said no. I also had no idea what the fuck was in the bag. So I go upstairs to my room, open up the prescription, and it's a huge box with this little tiny oval vaginal suppository that looks basically like a mini white Easter egg. You're welcome if I just ruined white Easter eggs for you. Also, I do not recommend you shove Easter eggs up your hoo It's not like Karen's yogurt tampons. Anyway, so I did that because that's what the instruction said in the box, and an adult told me to do it. I mean, I did have a yeast infection. I mean, so fucked up on so many levels. I remember feeling so embarrassed, thinking my mother is going to think that I'm sleeping around or something, which is funny because as I mentioned, I hadn't had sex yet. And although yeast infections can be sexually transmitted, it's not necessarily why you get them. I was highly sensitive to body soaps and bubble baths, and I remember taking fa bubble baths. Do you remember that? Do you remember fa? Ugh, LaSalle. When I did start having sex, there was a guy that I was dating who I'm pretty sure would dose his twig and berries with Jaccard Noir. Remember that from the eighties? Anyway, almost every single time we had sex, I would get a yeast infection. Yes. It was always a yeast infection, but I certainly would never shame anyone who had a STI. I remember going with a friend to the emergency department. She had chlamydia. We were both underage. On a school day chilling in the Cambridge Hospital ER. Also, that's not really bad thing, you know, supporting a friend and having your privacy protected. It was also not the eighteen hour wait that we see today. Anyway, I keep digressing. And I hope I'm using that word correctly. Anyway, fun fact, you can be allergic to semen, and I don't mean sailors. I mean, whatever floats your boat. But, anyway, so the cosmos really could have been telling me to stay away from this player, or maybe I was allergic to him, or maybe the other women that he was sleeping with had yeast infections, and he just kept passing them around to everybody. I mean, he did say that I was the only one, but people lie. I know. Shocker. I just wanted to take a little moment here and just shout out to my kids and their friends and to my husband for listening to my podcast. Thank you. I really appreciate the support. Please give me five stars. Anyway, because nobody really explained to me what a yeast infection was, I was always so embarrassed. I never went to the doctor until it was really absolutely necessary. I remember, and you're gonna be horrified when you hear this, but I remember literally grabbing medicinal peroxide, tossing my legs up in the air, and dumping peroxide to essentially numb my vagina to not feel the aggravation of a really horrible yeast infection. Now if you look on the peroxide bottles warning label, it says do not use on mucus membranes, which I believe includes your vajayjay. I finally went to the doctor who also told me to never put peroxide there ever again and got a prescription. Fast forward to living in Singapore, and after years of being yeast free, I got one. They don't sell the medication over the counter there, which is really unfortunate because if you have a yeast infection, as a woman, you fucking know what it is. Anyway, so I called the doctor's office and asked if they could call in a prescription I was told that they're not allowed to do that there and that it's mandatory that I come in. The patriarchy. Hard at work. Sodom. Anyway, I go into the small admin waiting room, combo area, and the nurse hands me a urine sample jar. And I'm like, no. No. I'm not here for that. And she says, in a normal voice that everyone can hear in the waiting room, oh, I thought you're here because you have a yeast infection. I said to her in the exact same voice with, like, you know, added sarcasm, gesturing to those around me. Oh, yes. Yes. I am here for a yeast infection medication. But maybe perhaps you need to say it a bit louder because this man over here with his toddler didn't quite hear you. And this teenage boy sitting here with his mom also didn't hear that I'm here because I have a fucking yeast infection. A yeast infection is not a urinary tract infection. Like, I don't understand why some doctors insist on having, urine samples. But, anyway, whatever. Didn't go to medical school. So I go years and years without having another yeast infection until recently. I'm starting to get them way too frequently. Thank God here in Toronto, you can just go and buy the medication over the counter. I might actually get stocks in Kinestan. I consulted doctor Google because even though I do like my GP, I'm so tired of going to doctors. According to doctor Google, many women in perimenopause and menopause start seeing a resurgence in yeast infections. Oh my god. Yay. Alison
But don't worry. Andrea
I'm staying away from the medicinal peroxide. But, you know, actually, this morning, before I started recording this, I did have a menopause consultation, with my menopause doctor, and I asked her about it. And she said that, yes, it's usually UTIs that women start seeing a, kind of increase when they're going through perimenopause and menopause because of the drop in estrogen. But she did say that it also can be yeast infection. So yay me. Also, you know what else is happening? My hair is getting so greasy. The hair in my head. The other hair I've developed some sort of Chelsea. You know, the punk rock cut where it's bald in the middle with a ring of hair. According to a dermatologist I went to, it could be a form of alopecia or hair loss from aging down there, like the vagina area, the pubic area. I swear, peneremenopause is exactly the same as puberty, but in reverse. I mean, honestly, if you look at the quote, unquote symptoms, they're basically the same. What a fucking struggle. Welcome to the fuck you fifties. Welcome to the fuck you fifties, the podcast for women who refuse to tolerate the bullshit anymore. This is real talk, real stories, and a long overdue reality check. I'm your host, Andrea Clare, and this podcast is the filter free voice you've been waiting for with a dose of f bombs, The fuck you fifties, unfiltered, unapologetic, and undeniably needed. My guest today is Allison Miller, who is a mental health counselor with a deep understanding of the mental health challenges women face at different stages of life. She emphasizes the importance of understanding the biological factors that influence behavior while promoting acceptance, self compassion, and empowerment in her approach. Her client base is diverse, but she frequently engages in discussions with friends about the unique mental health issues women encounter drawing on her own experiences as a woman in her fifties. Allison offers this perspective. Empowerment, kindness, self compassion, and how wonderful it is to be in your fifties and not be noticed, not on the radar, and therefore able to do whatever you want while ignoring others expectations. My take on that is it's almost like choosing to embrace the age of the invisibility cloak, wearing it as a superpower. I find that to be a little bit of an moment where our age group tends to struggle with invisibility. Flipping that perspective switch just might offer some solace. I clearly am not the type that wants to remain under an invisibility cloak, but that's where conversations like this offer relatable alternatives to anyone that's listening. There are no wrong answers. It's what works best for you. Please join me as I chat with Allison Miller. Welcome to the fuck you fifties. Sorry. Like, literally, it's like six AM. So my I'm still on my first coffee. Anyway okay. So so yeah. So Allison and I know each other from Singapore, and I was Allison's hairstylist. We met actually, at the Singapore American School. Right? That was, that was where we met. Right? Alison
Yep. Andrea
It's so funny. He's I I can't remember if somebody had recommended me to you to do your hair or if it was just me, like, chatting away. I don't when whenever I'm in a situation where I'm in, like, like, you know, stuff for Zoe at school or, you know, if it's not appropriate, I don't like, like, pitching myself to people because I I don't want people to be like, oh my god. Here she comes. I'm just gonna say she's a hairstylist again. You know? Alison
And I think too that I was under the impression that you wouldn't take just an average Joe, which may well be an Australian saying and not a Canadian saying, but so, it was not ever something I'd approached. But when I found out from others that you were happy to work with average Joes or Josephine's, I decided to reach out and approach you. And that's sort of how the connection began, I think. Yeah. Andrea
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And we do say average Joe here. So Okay. Alright. Good. Phew. Anyway, Allison, so sorry. Jump jumping back, please, like, kind of explain to the audience, your our listeners, your, your background. Alison
So I think in terms what's relevant to this episode of the podcast, is I've completed a master's of counselling, and I've had a big interest for a very long time in mental health and in not not in particular, just mental health in general. And I think my background from work has not been in mental health, but was something I was always interested in even, you know, post high school. And I kinda got talked out of it and went into banking and finance. And as I got older and started to see that I had, you know, a limited amount of time left in my work life and was going to soon be in a position where all the children had left home, I didn't want to be continuing to do a job that I found not necessarily very fulfilling. So I chose to go down the path of studying, and I I took some time to research. Like, I knew I wanted to work with people. I knew I wanted to help people. I knew I wanted to support them, but I wasn't really sure how. So I did some research and came up with a masters of counseling, and it's been a a very good decision. Andrea
Amazing. I find it, fascinating when you were saying that, you were talked out of it. And I'm very curious about that because I when I was getting into hair and makeup, so many people in my family tried to talk me out of it. And from from that perspective, it was like, oh, how how are you gonna make a living? You know, you're it's just gonna be an artist. Artists don't make any money. Like, are you sure it's funny what you wanna do? You know? And and then it wasn't until, like, years later when I ended up on TV where a lot of these family members that were telling me I would never do anything, you know, and I wouldn't make any money. All of a sudden I'm on television, and they're like, I always knew you're gonna make Alison
it. Yeah. I mean, I think for me, it was the case of particularly, my mother being concerned that and I had some of these concerns as well, that I would take on everybody else's problems, and I wouldn't be able to separate myself from those challenges, from those issues, and it would weigh me down and and, you know, be something that played on my mind. And maybe that's true. Maybe I didn't have the maturity in those in those days to be able to separate myself away. Now I find it I find that I can be empathetic, listen, and understand. And if I'm feeling challenged by what somebody is experiencing, actually happy to go away and research it and look for ways to help them, and it doesn't overwhelm me. I genuinely am interested and love to help and love to work with people and not to spend the time with them to help them through their challenges. So maybe I did need to wait this long. I I don't know. And I'll never have that back again, so it's not like I can make a comparison. It's not that I regret that time and those learnings. It's just time for something different. Andrea
Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, it it's interesting because, from the other women that I've talked to and, of course, just over the years being a hairstylist and, like, speaking to clients and things, is that it just seems like this age, that we're in, a lot of women kind of tend to do, like, a bit of a, like, a career pivot or something. And maybe it is kind of like dreams that you had when you were younger, and and maybe that is, like, the confidence and you know? It's like here I am doing a podcast where, you know, I've I, had this idea and Amy and I met and just kind of it just kinda worked out and kinda thrust into it. But one of the other things that I've always wanted to do is to do, Second City. And so they have Second City in Toronto and in in, in Chicago. A lot of comedians, that end up on SNL have taken Second City, and I've always wanted to do their improv classes. So and I've talked about it for years even lately. Like, I brought it up, and my kids are like, mom, you always talk about it. Why have you not done this yet? That that'll be my next segue anyway. So I know I sent you this kind of list of questions, but we're not necessarily gonna follow them, but I just wanted to kind of jump start into, I guess, one of the big things is, from from your knowledge, I guess, from maybe your personal knowledge, but also your expertise, like hormonal changes, and the impact that it has on us, emotionally as as we're, going through perimenopause and menopause. Can you speak about that a little bit? Alison
Yeah. A little bit. I'm not a physician, but, essentially, you know, estrogen and and progesterone for women are the are the two big hormones that, you know, gradually increase as we go through puberty and then sort of sit at a certain level. And then as we approach perimenopause and menopause, they start to drop off. And as they both drop off, you start to become a little more anxious, a little more irritable. It affects things like your ability to get a good night's sleep. It affects things like your ability to think clearly. Right. And those things obviously put added pressure on how you feel about yourself because the way that you used to be able to function is not a way that you can function anymore. And you don't you're not necessarily looking for it. You don't necessarily understand why. So I think that, you know, if I was to talk about me, I would notice that I would just be standing in a supermarket and all of a sudden feel overwhelmed by anxiety for no apparent reason. And this was actually at the time of COVID as well, so I was kind of questioning, am I is this because of COVID? Is this because of something else? Is there what's what's going on? I've put it together now, and I think it was probably a little bit of a mix of both, but definitely more, I think, sitting on the you know, going through hormonal shifts side of things because it does. It can just come out of the blue and be overwhelming. And this is where you get, fluctuations in hormones of, you know, what caused, obviously, hot flushes, not being able to to sleep, etcetera. And they also just come out of the blue in the same way that a wave of anxiety can just come out of the blue or leg cramps can just come out of the blue, you know, whatever physical changes that you have and and that can take you off guard. And obviously, all of these things, unless you're really prepared and very comfortable and okay with it, can absolutely play havoc on people's mental health. Andrea
Absolutely. You know, I I just when you're kind of explaining that in the anxiety and just, like, the mood changes and everything, like so this is what I'm thinking about. If it's women of a certain age that get slapped this this kind of title or label as a Karen when they're just middle aged, stressed out. And I think in some cases, you have every right to ask for the manager. But I feel like our age category now is kind of like, hesitant to do that, because it's like, well, no one's gonna take me seriously, because they're gonna just like, say, oh, my God, she's being such a Karen, you know? And I think that that really has to do with a lot of, like, perimenopause, menopause. Again, I just wanna stress not the extreme cases of people, like, jumping on people in parks and telling them that they're not allowed to be there. But, anyway, what do you think? What's your thought process on that? Alison
I think that one of the things that happens is, you know, as women, we go through life and we are nurturers. You know? By nature, we are nurturers. And when we get to this particular perimenopause, menopause phase of life, that leaves us. And we've devoted so much time to caring for others and all of a sudden the only person that we're interested in in caring about is ourselves. And so we start to become a little more vocal a little more aware and a little more vocal about what we're prepared to tolerate and what we're not prepared to tolerate. And I think that that might be what plays into, oh, you know, what what you've kind of suggested. She's, you know, really trying to be very difficult, not go along for the ride. She's not, you know, gonna do just what what we tell her to do. Yeah. I think that that's where that comes from. I personally have found that particular journey extremely empowering, not really caring what other people think anymore. Andrea
Yep. Alison
And that journey has led me to be able to step back and really consider whether things are my problem or are not my problem and whether I want to devote energy to them or whether I don't want to devote energy to them. And that is so incredibly freeing if you one of the things that often we talk about in counseling is what would your life look like if that anxiety, that worry, that stress, that sadness, if you took it out? And when you think about that in this context of having been this nurturer for your whole life and caring about everybody else's needs and putting everybody else before you put yourself, and then all of a sudden you don't feel like you have to do that anymore and you don't really understand why, sure, your kids have probably grown up and they're moving out, etcetera, but there's also a biological thing that's going on that's stopping that. It can be really liberating, extremely freeing, and I think that's one of the things that helps women come into their own in this phase of life. Andrea
Do you do you think some women also, feel a sense of loss in that then? Alison
One hundred percent. If you're prepared to let it go and run with it. And there's initial hesitation obviously because there's a grieving process and if you look at the definition of grief, it's really just the loss of something. You're never going to get it back the way that it was before. So it's not necessarily the death of a person. It's the ending of something, the loss of something that is never gonna come back in the way that it was before. So for a lot of people whose women whose lives have been about taking care of the family, looking after other people, taking care of the kids, and all of a sudden they find that that's not there or they can see they're staring down the barrel of that that not going to be there anymore. It can be really, really unsettling, and that in itself is a transition that many women find very difficult. I encourage people to be okay with accepting that that's a hard change and be okay with sitting in that for as long as you need to, but also be okay with looking at it and saying, yeah. I'm saying goodbye to that, and I loved it. But look at all these things over here that I can do now that I didn't have the time for before, I didn't have the energy for before, or that can be about me. And you people, I I love you to death, and I obviously wanna keep you in my life, but it's a little bit of time for me over here now. Andrea
Yes. For sure. And I guess too when you're saying, like, I still wanna keep you in your life in my life. Maybe in some cases, it's like, I also don't wanna keep you in my life. Yeah. Which brings me to this is really interesting. So I've been, like, I've been trying to, to focus on, like, researching, each guest I have. I try to research a little bit of background for our conversation. And the one thing that I I came about, which I found was really interesting, and so Psychology Today, had this article that talks about your your cortisol, cortisol levels, where your body stores your fat. Right? And and, and it's about your, like, stress levels. And that when you get rid of stress or, which can include toxic relationships, I found this interesting, that people can just and and I don't I don't I definitely don't wanna turn this conversation or any conversation I ever have. I don't wanna talk about, like, women, like, losing weight because I kinda feel like that is a negative. I mean, sometimes the results are a positive, but I I it drives me crazy when you see all these Instagram ads of, like, so, like, sorry. Like, sad about your waistline. Wanna do this. Wanna do that. And is obviously targeting, like, middle aged women. It pisses me off because it just, like, we're not a target market, so stop selling this bullshit to us. But I just think about, you know, when I when I divorced my first husband, and I didn't I didn't diet or, like, anything. Like, I just I lost a ton of weight. You know? And and it just made me think of that when I read that article. But how much of that could be in relation to, just our stress levels? Alison
Our cortisol levels increase as we start to go through perimenopause and menopause and that is a direct response of the estrogen and progesterone dropping. I think that when you are under a lot of stress, your cortisol levels increase because it is by definition the stress hormone. So, that that happens naturally. And when your cortisol levels increase, all sorts of things happen. You can't think clearly. Your energy levels drop. You go into fight, flight, or freeze mode. Andrea
I I find too that, you know, another thing that kind of puts, us in a, you know I don't know if it's stress or or, what the right emotion would be, but, social media, I find. I mean, social media can be great. It could be such like a like a nice place where we can, like, find information, but it could also be a negative just from some of the messaging that is out there. I know for myself, like, every once in a while I go through, and maybe not everybody knows this, but especially on Instagram because I'm always on it. You can go into your settings and you can put in certain keywords so it blocks certain conversations. So I've gone through and I've done that. But what's your kind of perspective and how it affects us, social or, like, from social media and a and a mental health perspective? Alison
I I personally try and stay off it as much as possible. I don't encourage, you know, doom scrolling, which is, I guess, what they call it a lot now because, first of all, it's it's not food for the brain. It it's literally just draining you of energy. You're looking at things that take away from who you are and fill your head with emptiness. You know, it's the junk food of connection, social media. We should be more connected via social media, but we're actually less connected globally than we've ever been before because we don't talk to our neighbors anymore. I think people, when they use it, spend so much time comparing themselves to others. And I know that that sounds, you know, completely okay. Well, yeah, I'm not an idiot. I guess, you know, everybody knows that that's what they're doing. But I don't think that people actually really understand the saying that comparison is the thief of joy. And it it has taken me a long time to really truly understand what that means and accept that, you know, looking at something else and comparing what somebody else has to what I have or what I don't have, which I can so easily do now on social media, takes away from my happiness. Andrea
It's true. You're right. It you know, it's it's unfortunate too because most people are only posting the great things about them or the fabricated things about them. It's like advertising. Right? So advertising is there to kinda set aspirations. It's like selling this this fictitional life. They want you to want it. You know? So that's, the same thing. And it it's unfortunate that people are not, more honest about about it. But honest won't get you followers necessarily. I mean, maybe in some cases. And honesty definitely won't get you paid for collaborations from beauty brands or lifestyle brands. Like, they want to see that kind of advertising, which is Yeah. Which is funny because that also has influenced my industry and how much work comes in. And it oh, it's so interesting. So on on my on my job yesterday, and this this woman comes over and is talking to the other hairstylist and I, and she was saying, oh, my hair is like the texture's really changed. I you know, she doesn't like how it's turning out. Like and then this other hairstylist said to her, well, where are you getting your information? Because she was saying that she was using some sort of stripping agent on her hair. And he's like, who's telling you to do this? And she's like, oh, I got the information from TikTok. Right. And we were both like, now I knew it was just hair. Like, it's not, like, necessarily mental health. Although, if your hair is not great, that can affect your mental health too. Right? But but it was like, stop getting your information from social media. Alison
Yeah. And look, I love it for I I do love it for the, point of view of being able to see something like a snippet of a podcast, for example, which I can look at and say, oh, I find that interesting and that's going to teach me something. And therefore, you know, I want to listen to that podcast and I want to learn more. I also don't watch the news so anymore because I find that that is just emotionally draining and doesn't serve a purpose for me. That's one of my mental health tricks. Andrea
That's a good one. I also stopped watching the news. Like, why? Like, you leave feeling or not leave, but, like, turn off the TV or or the computer, whatever feeling, like, stressed about what's what's, what's going on. Yep. What, what do you think are some, symptoms that someone might be experiencing for mental health as they're going through perimenopause and menopause? Alison
Certainly, confusion. And I think confusion is one of the big things because you can typically deal with anything if you can understand it and you know what's going on. You can put it into context. But because things are going up and down and coming at you when you least expect it and one day you feel great and the next day you don't. And so then you, you know, start some people can start to question their sanity as well as question their health, their physical health, you know, all sorts of different changes. Maybe you used to be really super effective at work, but some brain fog's kicking in and you can't make decisions the way that you used to. You might find yourself walking down the street thinking I'm gonna go and buy x, y, and zed, and then getting there and feeling overwhelmed by choice for no apparent reason. I think that that's one of the big things that people don't understand what's going on. The anxiety that that comes in is another really, really big one and questioning how we show up when we get to that that state. How do we want to show up? Is anybody going to listen to me? Is anybody going to be interested in the wisdom I've gained? Does anybody care? All of those questions which can lead to a huge amount of self doubt, which can lead to, you know, really, feeling very sad, quite depressed, very anxious. Andrea
What would be a red flag for someone that they they would think, like, oh, I should I should really, like, seek some help on this? Alison
I think if you're at a in a space where the things that you used to enjoy doing, you no longer enjoy doing and you find them to be a chore and not something that you're keen to get out of bed and tackle, or if you find yourself frequently crying and frequently feeling so overwhelmed that you can't leave the house or you can't get out of the car if you've driven to the shopping center or, you know, any of those almost paralyzing feelings, they definitely should seek mental help, mental health help. I I also think, you know, in the in the space where people are really questioning, how do I navigate life now that I'm in this phase? How do I now actively be comfortable to say, I'm choosing me, and I'm happy and proud to choose me. And I'm when I'm choosing me, I'm looking for who I wanna be and what I wanna do. I think for a lot of women, that's extremely overwhelming because they've never done it before. You You know, counselling can be really helpful for that. Andrea
I love that. I'm choosing me. I think that's great. Alison
Yeah. I I think if they're not sleeping because that can be a real thing, and a prolonged period of no sleep, can really affect your mental health. And that may be not only a trip to a counsellor but also a trip to a GP or a naturopath or, you know, something that can help to start to facilitate sleep again. Sleep's one of the big things. If you can't sleep, you can't think, you can't exercise, you can't eat properly, like it really ticks over on everything. And I think too in the same way as people say, if you think you have an alcohol problem, if you think you have a mental health problem, you probably do, and it doesn't hurt to go and see somebody even if it's just for one or two sessions. You know, maybe you just need a bit of a recalibration, a sanity check, am I okay? Is these are these things normal? Is it is it okay that I'm feeling this way? I I think that rule sort of applies as well. Andrea
Yeah. Absolutely. And I I this is where I feel like, like, my podcast needs conversations and and other podcasts, podcasts, like, that are quite similar. Maybe having similar conversations that people can listen to and and kind of think like that. Like, this is normal. But I guess there's also, you know, that line in the sand where it's like, you know, could be normal, but then if it's a bit more on the extreme, that's when, like, seeing like, seeking out help is great. You know, I've spent so much time of my life going through, like, counseling and therapy and stuff just because of my childhood. And and I'm like, I'm such an advocate for mental health health. You know, the other thing that I was reading about recently is, is sleep divorce. And it's usually married couples that after a certain amount of time of being together, they still love each other. They still they're not looking to get divorced, but they either sleep in separate beds in the same room or they sleep in separate bedrooms. And that concept is about getting better sleep, and better sleep, like, reduces your anxiety, reduces your blood pressure, which I understand because my blood pressure goes really high when my husband's snoring beside me. Alison
I think everyone's does. Andrea
Yeah. Yeah. Side note. I slept in the guest room last night at two o'clock in the morning. I was like, I remember in Singapore going to look at one house, and the master bedroom had two single beds. And I remember thinking, what kind of marriage is that? Like, that's ridiculous. Two single bed. Like, automatically, I start judging their their marriage. Right? And then I have a client who also or had a client. It was one of my clients in Singapore. Her and her husband slept in separate bedrooms for years and never even occurred to me. And I think maybe that's because it's portrayed, you know, in movies and in, like, sitcoms in the fifties. Like, this is what we do. You know? But, yeah. So just what you were saying, just like like sleep is one of the big things that we we need for, I guess, so many things. Right? Alison
Yeah. We really do. And and I think, you know, there is more awareness being brought to this topic. And I think that, you know, if it if it can be viewed as an opportunity to shift direction, move forward, have a bit of a new and a different experience, and see it as a positive thing, I'm all for it. And it means I can just kinda get along and and do what I wanna do and do what I need to do and be on my own terms and no one I I don't care anymore, a, if people are judging me. So maybe they are judging me. I'm not paying attention to it. But I I do feel like that a lot of women start to feel invisible at this age. And is it because we're at this age, or is it because they don't care anymore? I don't know. But whatever way, it's working for me. Andrea
I Alison
found some of the, social media around this phase of life can be a little forceful. We need to talk about menopause, you know, and we do, but I I don't know that I necessarily personally want it in my face at that level. You know? I do want awareness, and I do think that women should feel free to talk about it with whomever they choose to talk about it. It doesn't mean they need to talk about it to everybody. I wouldn't talk about all of the things I do in my life to everybody. Why do I need to talk about this to everybody? Andrea
You know, it it it's so true, and and I think, like, this was one of my inspirations of doing the podcast because I was just so tired of seeing all this messaging online. And, again, I agree that we definitely need to talk about it. But the the sales pitches, like the buy this vitamin, use this like sweet potato cream. Like, and, like, it was just kinda like, oh my god. Stop. I and and then also to your point about, like, we don't need to talk about it with everybody. I I have never had a hot flash. Now I have an IUD because my gynecologist in Singapore before I moved back to Canada, said you should get the Mirena IUD fresh, because it's got I I think it has estrogen in it. Again, I'm also not a doctor, but she said it'll help with symptoms. Alison
Mhmm. Andrea
So, and I I always think it's funny using the word symptoms with menopause, like it's an illness, but it's I guess there's no other, like, term to use. But, anyway, so I've never had a hot flash. This is not a brag. This is just, like, a fact. Right? And I guess not every woman gets them anyway. But I was on set, and a male photographer, I don't remember the context, but he made some joke at me saying something about hot flashes. And it kinda took me back a little bit because I also kinda thought like, a, that's completely inappropriate. And then it's also like you're making some sort of, like, joke about my age, and this is a professional setting. So why I mean, my industry tends to be very relaxed. A lot of things that we talk about or say or whatever. But I think, again, there is that, you know, division of, like, what's appropriate and what's not appropriate. And definitely making some smart ass comment about one of your crew, like, having a hot flash or whatever it was. It was just like, so so frustrating. Alison
And I I think too, you know, people forget that there are, women who go into this phase of life because they have to surgically. Right? So they have to have a hysterectomy for whatever reason, and they're therefore forced down this route before they ordinarily would have been, and and it happens very suddenly. So they've got a whole other, set of issues to deal with because it's not something that it may or may not have been explained properly to them when they were told that they needed to have a hysterectomy, what was going to happen. And not only are they trying to recover from surgery and feeling like they've had, you know, a good chunk of their body removed from them and grieving that loss, then they're also all of a sudden thrown into menopause and they've got all these swings going on and maybe hormone replacement therapy works for them, maybe it doesn't. But I don't think that when anybody is joking in inverted commas about symptoms or, challenges that women face at this phase of life, I don't think people typically consider that population of person and they don't offer support so much to that particular population of of women. You know, for those women who are receiving social media messages from people trying to sell this cream and that cream and, you know, they're probably sitting there thinking, well, I would have gladly used this cream or that cream if I wasn't in this position that I'm in today because of health reasons that I had to go down this road. You know? I don't think that any of that is kind of factored into it. Andrea
Yeah. I I also think too that, that when we're seeing all these, like, sales, like, pushed at us for, like, buying various creams and vitamins and whatever. I think that we need to remember to maybe not get sucked into those sales and Yeah. Go see your GP or if you're seeing a menopause specialist. And and and I I love doctor Jen Gunter for all this stuff too because she also says, like, see who is selling the product. It's it's padding their pocketbooks versus necessarily helping. So we really have to trust who we're, you know, getting that medical advice from. Alison
And it's it's preying on people's vulnerability, which is obviously Yes. You know, the the whole point, which goes back to the the point of if you are feeling vulnerable, if you are feeling unsure, try and and get some help, whether that's from a medical professional, ask some questions, or whether if you feel like you just need a couple of sessions with a counselor or even a group therapy session or, you know, anything along those lines, go talk to somebody. Share share what's going on for you in terms of the vulnerability. Get it out there. Talk about it so that you're not feeling pressured. Andrea
Yes. Absolutely. So so, this is, like, all such great, like, information and shares, and I I feel like we're we're, we're great. I just have I have one one more question. And then, of course, if there's anything else you feel like you wanna add, like, absolutely. But aside from, like, seeking professional help, do you have any, kind of coping suggestions that you give to, you know, whether it's your friends or whether it's, like, people that you see in sessions? And, you know, some people, unfortunately, will also never seek mental health because they just don't. They're embarrassed by it or whatever. And, hey. And, also, like, to those people, I wanna say, like, please don't be embarrassed about it. Like, it's a it's always, like, a confidential thing when you see a mental health expert, and it can really, really help you. Like, I literally started seeing a mental health expert when I, gosh, I think I was in grade eight. Well, so whatever that age that makes you, and I'm turning fifty four this Sunday. Alison
Woo hoo. Happy birthday. Andrea
I know. Not looking forward to that, but, anyway yeah. So, anyway, back to you, Allison. Do you have any, like, coping suggestions you have for people? Alison
Yeah. I mean, sleep is definitely one. Making sure you're getting a good night sleep is definitely one, you know, as often as you can. Physical activity is another one. So whatever type of exercise it is that works for you and however much you think you can do. Like, don't set yourself up for failure. If you think if you say to yourself, I'm gonna go for a walk for an hour every day, you know that's not achievable, then then don't set that as your target. You know, set the target as what it is that you think you are actually capable of doing and work towards that. I think, you know, relaxation techniques, breathing techniques, meditation, yoga, Pilates, whatever it is that that floats your boat around, you know, those types of, things. Breathing techniques, I think, are are wonderful. You can actually, you know, really short circuit a negative thinking pattern just by starting to breathe and letting it go, you know, actively imagining it leaving your head. We can really get into negative thinking patterns when the hormones are going up and down and, you know, all of a sudden some little minor irritation has turned into I'm the worst person on the planet and why would anybody ever care about me, you know. And and that transition takes about thirteen, maybe fourteen seconds. So if you can sort of imagine those negative things leaving your brain, actually picturing that happen, I think, is is a really good, tool. Trying to limit the stresses that are in your life. So if you know that there's somebody or something that causes you to be stressed, try not to be involved with that because you you you know, your priority is to look after yourself as much as you possibly can, and you're no good to anybody else unless you've looked after yourself. So Yeah. If, you know, going to the post office and standing in line for two hours causes you stress and you're already feeling anxious on that particular day, put it off. The world's not gonna end. You know? Like, actually take a little bit of time for self care. Be compassionate to yourself when you are feeling overwhelmed. Acknowledge that you're feeling overwhelmed. Acknowledge that all these things are coming at you, and it's not your fault, and it's okay and it's okay to stand there and say, I'm gonna be kind to myself today because I'm not a bad human. It's just that these things are happening right now. Andrea
There's a TV show that just, launched here called Small Achievable Goals, And, it's it's all about perimenopause and menopause, and the two women that are behind it are, you know, comedy. I think they're well, they're comedians and actors, and and I think that that really kind of fits in with what you're saying too. Like, if you can't make that one hour walk that you're promising yourself. And I'm wondering to kind of maybe start getting into the habit. Maybe each morning, instead of, like, saying, like, this week, every day I'm doing this, maybe you just get those small achievable goals in the morning. You wake up in the morning, and you're like, today, I'm gonna do a ten minute walk. Alison
Yeah. Andrea
You know? Or or today, I'm going to go to the post office. But I like your suggestion of, like, if you get somewhere and you're just not feeling it. And I honestly have done this before. I just turned my car around. I'm like, you know what? I'm just just not gonna not gonna Alison
do that. But I think the trick there with that is is to not beat yourself up about it when you do it. Like, it's not a case of, I'm just gonna turn my car around and go home and feel defeated. Yeah. Owning it. You know? I couldn't do it today, and that's okay. And I think that's the problem is people don't come at it with that attitude. They come at it with the attitude, oh, I'm so hopeless. I couldn't even go to the post office. And that's that negative mindset again as opposed to this is not my fault. I'm going through things, and I'm doing the best I can. I did not wake up today with the plan in my head of being the second best version of myself. I woke up today with a plan in my head of of doing the best I can, and that's what I do. I'm doing the best I can. Andrea
I guess when you have those negative thoughts coming into your head where you're feeling defeated, you can just use that, that saying, which I don't even know where it came from, but it's like, not today, Satan. Not today. Alison
I don't know where that one came from. Andrea
It's probably, like, from a movie or, like, maybe, like, I don't know, Saturday Night Live or something. I don't know. It's so funny. Alison
Yeah. I have no idea. And for some women, hormone replacement therapy works. That's a medical thing, though. Like, it I think that that really does help for some women, and that's an individual choice for everyone. Andrea
Yeah. Absolutely. And, of course, you know, with with, what your doctor says as well. I I met a woman on a on a photo shoot, who was, like, in this age category, and she said that she chose not to take any medication, no hormones or anything. And she said it was a bit of a roller coaster, but she soldiered on and she came up the other side, and she's, like, perfectly fine. Mhmm. And, again, you know, I'm also not a medical doctor, so I don't know it. But it was just interesting having these conversations with with people and just hearing kind of what their choices were. You know? I've been on, like, estrogen cream, which I found, like, it didn't do anything for me. But, again, I have this IUD, so maybe it's not necessarily, necessary anyway. And then I've been given progesterone recently, and, honestly, I stopped taking it because I kind of, like I'm, like, I don't see any changes. Like, I Yeah. You know? And I don't know. Like, I'm I'm all I'm sure doctors hate me because even, you know, for I have an autoimmune disorder, and they're like, have you been taking your medication? It's like, well, it was for, like, a month, and they're like, you gotta keep doing it. You can't just, like, not take it. Like, worry. Yeah. Anyway, I have one more thought, and then then we should wrap this up. Alison
Okay. Andrea
Earlier when you were just talking about, about, like, the, like, the demons and, like, the thought process and everything and, like, things that kinda stop you and and, just just even doing this podcast. Right? I was saying to my husband one day, I think after the second episode aired, and I was like I said to him, like, who the fuck do I think I am? Like, starting a podcast. Like, nobody's gonna fucking listen to it. You know, I just kinda went off on my little kind of, like, you know, downward spiral of, like, why am I doing this? Like, no one's gonna like it, you know, whatever. And then the next day, a listener sent me a really, really lovely message about how they feel validated, how they and and I just kinda think, like, one person sent me this nice message. And and I remember from years ago when I used to do a TV show, my friend Karen, who was the the second guest, I remember her saying to me, and back then, people would mail letters. But she she said, for every one person that said something I I honestly don't remember what her numbers were, but it was, like, for every one person that says something, there is, like, a bunch of them behind. But she said, people that have negative things to say, they'll they'll all, like, jump forward, which I guess shows you that kind of in the trolls in social media. You know? And you see more negative comments and positive. Alison
Yeah. I mean, it it's crazy. Right? The the bad stuff is easier to believe, which I think is a line out of Pretty Woman, but it's it's so true. We we we can tell ourselves stories in our heads, and we can tell ourselves a story of you suck, why would anybody listen to you, you know, why would anybody interested in any anything that you have to say? You can equally tell yourself you're awesome. Of course, people are gonna listen to me. I'm actually wise. I've spent a lot of time doing a whole bunch of really interesting things that people might care about. It's the same. Telling yourself a negative thing is the same as telling yourself a positive thing, but we all automatically going go towards telling ourselves a negative thing. And we get stuck on it and we believe it. And that's another piece that I think that people need to work on. And I also wanna throw in there, if it's making you happy and you're enjoying it, who cares? Andrea
Oh my god. I love that. Yeah. Alison
Like, honestly. Yeah. Who cares? If you're loving doing it, go ahead and do it. Andrea
That's a really great note to end on. I could I would love I mean, I have so many more things. Like, I have two pages two pages printed out. But, Allison, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. Alison
Oh, you're welcome. Thanks for the opportunity. I was really curious to do this, like, really curious to do it because I've not done it before. So I hope I did okay. Andrea
You did, amazing. And I love there's so many, like like, as as we're chatting, I'm I'm like, some of the things that you said, I'm like, thank thank that, not only for, like, sharing, but also for myself. Alison
Yeah. Well, we can book a session whenever you like. Andrea
Yeah. Thank you. I feel like I'm definitely guilty of, like, that that negative conversation in my head, and I definitely need to spin it to the to the positive. I think I need to work on that. Alison
Which is not easy to do. It takes practice. It really does take practice. And it takes not being frightened of what might be on the other side if you let go of the negative because people get really frightened of it. Because if if there's no negative, there's no reason to not do the thing anymore. Right. And then they're like, well, shit. If I do the thing, what if it fails? Do what? It fails. You know? Like, it but but people don't people don't do it. It's really hard. Andrea
It is really hard. Thanks for tuning in to the fuck you fifties. If you enjoyed this episode, please take a moment to follow and rate the podcast. And we'd love to connect with you on Instagram, so be sure to follow us at the fuck you fifties. The fuck you fifties is hosted by Andrea Clare and edited and produced by Bespoke Productions Hub. See you next time. 
